Kingdon Diagnostics / BB-Demo – Negotiation
Callcompleted
Kingdon Diagnostics · 2025-08-29 11:45
Graeme Charlton, the CFO, questioned the return on a £2,934 plus VAT addition because fewer people are logging in and the champion has left. The price is held while Marcus Bell runs a usage review before any decision.
What was said
What this says
Current to 13 Oct 26Graeme Charlton, the CFO, questioned the return on a £2,934 plus VAT addition because fewer people are logging in and the champion has left. The price is held while Marcus Bell runs a usage review before any decision.
What happened: Lewis Kerr and Owen Tallis negotiated a £2,934 plus VAT addition, co-termed to the January renewal, with Graeme Charlton and Kirsty Robson. Graeme turned the call to usage before price.
Customer view: Graeme said fewer people are logging in and the champion who made it work has left. Kirsty said she is the only regular user in her finance team, so it is a skills gap as much as a value gap.
Commercial: Owen declined to discount and held the price instead, so Kingdon need not sign by 8 Sep 2025. Graeme treats that date as a target and said they may not buy.
Watch: Marcus Bell leads a usage review before any decision. The real question is the value of the existing subscription, not only the addition.
Themes
Current to 9 Oct 26Theme
Usage doubts on addition
Importance
upsell
Sentiment
mixed
Voice
decision-maker
Who was there
BB-Demo
CRMmade from
Them
CRMmade from
Follow-up
Next steps
Current to 9 Oct 26- Marcus Bell to run a usage review within a couple of weeks, with Lewis Kerr confirming the date in writing to Graeme and Kirsty by the end of that week.
- Lewis Kerr to send a revised quote the same day with the price held and VAT stated.
- Graeme Charlton to decide on the addition after the review.
Risks
Current to 9 Oct 26- Active users are down on the previous quarter and the champion has left, leaving forty licensed seats lightly used.
- Graeme may not buy the addition if the usage picture is no better after the review.
- Finance budget is tight, and Kirsty would be back asking if the scope grew.
Opportunities
Current to 9 Oct 26- A usage review led by Marcus Bell could rebuild the value case ahead of the January renewal.
- Kirsty's use of the brain to match invoices to the trust is a working example other colleagues could adopt.
Transcript
Lewis Kerr NoneHello, Graeme. Hello, Kirsty. Just waiting for Owen, he's joining from another call.
Kirsty Robson NoneHello, Lewis. No problem. I've got the proposal open, so I can start with my questions if that's easier.
Owen Tallis NoneSorry, sorry. I'm here. Good morning all. Owen Tallis, I look after the sales team at BB-Demo, and I've sat in on this one since Lewis flagged it. Where does the deal stand against the date, Lewis?- Lewis Kerr NoneExpected close is 8 Sep 2025, so a little over a week. Stage is negotiation. Total value is £2,934 plus VAT, co-termed to the January renewal. Graeme and Kirsty have had the proposal for a couple of weeks.
Graeme Charlton NoneThanks. Let me be direct, because I've got a hard stop. Before I talk about the price, I'd like to talk about the usage. Kirsty pulled the figures, and fewer people are logging in than before. What's the return on something we're not using?- Owen Tallis NoneThat's a fair challenge and I won't dodge it. Lewis, what do we see on our side?
- Lewis Kerr NoneThe active users are down on the previous quarter, and it's a bigger drop than when we spoke earlier in the month. It's a small base, which makes the percentage look worse than it feels, but I wouldn't pretend it isn't there. The champion on your side has also moved on, which has left a gap.
- Graeme Charlton NoneYes. That's the part that worries me. She was the one who made it work. Now I've got forty licensed seats and not many people asking it anything.
- Kirsty Robson NoneCan I add the finance side? From where I sit, the brain is useful for matching invoices to the trust, but I'm the only one in my team using it regularly, and I'm not sure my colleagues know what it can do for them. So it's a skills gap as much as a value gap.
- Owen Tallis NoneThat's helpful, Kirsty. Then let's separate two things. One is whether this addition is worth it. The other is whether the subscription is delivering what you bought it for. I'd say the second matters more, and I'd rather fix that than sell you something on top.
- Graeme Charlton NoneI would agree with that. Keep it simple.
- Lewis Kerr NoneCan I suggest this? Marcus Bell is your CSM. He owns adoption. I'd like him to run a usage review with you and Kirsty, and with whoever has taken over the contracts work, and set out who is asking what, and what's not being used. Then you decide on the addition knowing that.
- Graeme Charlton NoneYes. I'd want that before I sign anything. When would it happen?
- Owen Tallis NoneWhat's the next dated step, Lewis? I don't want a vague promise on this call.
- Lewis Kerr NoneI'll ask Marcus today to put a date in your diaries within a couple of weeks. I'll confirm the date in writing to Graeme and Kirsty by the end of the week.
- Owen Tallis NoneGood. And I'll back Marcus up on that. He leads it, I don't overrule him. If he thinks the right answer is a smaller scope, or waiting, then that's what we do.
- Kirsty Robson NoneRight, then can I ask the practical questions so they're answered whatever you decide? First, is the £2,934 inclusive or exclusive of VAT?
- Lewis Kerr NoneExclusive. VAT is added on top at the standard rate on the invoice. The proposal shows both lines so it's clear.
- Kirsty Robson NoneThank you. Second, when would it be invoiced? Our approvals run on a monthly cycle and I don't want it landing in the wrong period.
- Lewis Kerr NoneOn signature, on thirty day terms, which is our standard. If you'd prefer to align it with the January renewal invoice, I can look at that, but I'd have to check it with our finance team before promising it.
- Kirsty Robson NoneI'd prefer on signature, to be honest, so it's tidy and sits against this year's budget. Graeme, is that right?
- Graeme Charlton NoneYes. This year. Is that within budget, Kirsty? I believe it is.
- Kirsty Robson NoneIt is, just. It's tight rather than comfortable. If the scope grew, I'd be back asking.
- Graeme Charlton NoneThen, Owen, I'll ask the obvious thing. Is there any movement on the figure?
- Owen Tallis NoneI'll be straight with you, Graeme. It's already a modest figure and it's priced against your current agreement. If I took money off it now, I'd be discounting something already tight, and then we'd be having the same conversation at renewal. Let's not discount twice. What I can do is protect you on the timing: you don't have to sign by the eighth just to hold the price.
- Graeme Charlton NoneThat's useful. I'd rather do it properly than fast. So the price holds while the review happens?
- Owen Tallis NoneYes. Lewis will confirm that in writing, with the date it holds to. I won't leave you guessing.
- Lewis Kerr NoneI'll put that in the revised quote, with the VAT position stated, and send it over today.
- Kirsty Robson NoneThen from finance I'm content. I'll wait for the review and the revised quote.
- Graeme Charlton NoneAgreed. We keep 8 Sep 2025 as a target, not a promise. If the usage picture is no better, I'll say so, and we may not buy it.
- Owen Tallis NoneThat's honest and we'd rather hear it. Lewis, recap please.
- Lewis Kerr NoneMarcus runs a usage review within a couple of weeks, date confirmed to you both by the end of this week. I send a revised quote today with the price held and VAT stated. Graeme decides after the review. Invoicing on signature, thirty day terms.
- Graeme Charlton NoneGood. Thank you all. I have to go.
- Kirsty Robson NoneThanks, everyone. Speak soon.
- Owen Tallis NoneThanks, both. Bye now.
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