Brenneck Pay / BB-Demo – Negotiation
Callcompleted
Brenneck Pay · 2026-10-05 13:30
Brenneck Pay's COO will not sign the Growth to Enterprise expansion until security and procurement conclude. The 7 Oct 2026 close date was dropped and the close marked At risk on BB-Demo's side.
What was said
What this says
Current to 13 Oct 26Brenneck Pay's COO will not sign the Growth to Enterprise expansion until security and procurement conclude. The 7 Oct 2026 close date was dropped and the close marked At risk on BB-Demo's side.
What happened: Matteo Ricci and Owen Tallis tested the working close date of 7 Oct 2026 with Matthias Ebner, Dennis Wolter and Henrik Lorenz. The customer said it was not realistic.
Customer view: Dennis asked whether £125k was a new annual price. Matteo said it is the total expansion value including the one-off implementation fee, and promised a line-by-line split in writing.
Commercial: Single sign-on is a security requirement, and engineering has not agreed a date for it. Owen declined a second discount and said introductory terms apply to the first term only. The Growth contract runs to 2 Feb 2027, with renewal on 3 Feb 2027.
Watch: Exit and handover wording, termination for convenience and the sub-processor statement are all open. Matthias wants everything in writing.
Themes
Current to 9 Oct 26Theme
Enterprise expansion terms
Importance
upsell
Sentiment
mixed
Voice
decision-maker
Who was there
BB-Demo
CRMmade from
Them
CRMmade from
Follow-up
Next steps
Current to 9 Oct 26- Matteo Ricci sends one written summary the day after the call with the commercial split, exit wording, credit clauses and sub-processor statement.
- Henrik Lorenz sends the outsourcing addendum and Owen Tallis returns a marked-up version.
- Matteo Ricci confirms a dated single sign-on answer with a named owner, or states it is not yet agreed.
Risks
Current to 9 Oct 26- The 7 Oct 2026 close is not realistic, as information security and procurement have not concluded.
- No engineering date is agreed for single sign-on, which the customer's security team requires.
- Exit handover wording, termination notice and the sub-processor statement are still open for the supplier register.
Opportunities
Current to 9 Oct 26- Enterprise offers single sign-on, user and connector headroom and freshness credits, which answer the customer's stated needs.
- Premium support with a named engineer can be priced separately if the customer asks.
Transcript
Matteo Ricci NoneGood afternoon, everyone. Can you hear me all right? I have Owen with me from our side today, so it is the two of us.
Matthias Ebner NoneGood afternoon, Matteo. Yes, we hear you well. Henrik and Dennis are both here.
Henrik Lorenz NoneHello. Sorry, my camera is being slow, give me one moment.
Dennis Wolter NoneAfternoon. I am here, audio is fine. Did everyone get through the morning? We had a fire drill, which did not help.
Owen Tallis NoneHa, no, that is a good way to start a Monday. Afternoon, all. Thanks for making the time.- Matteo Ricci NoneSo, let me restate where we are, and then Matthias, please correct me. The expansion from Growth to Enterprise is open, and our working close date is Wednesday 7 October 2026, which is two days away. I would rather we say today whether that date is realistic, rather than discover on Wednesday that it is not.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThank you. The decision needed is simple to state. We must decide whether to move the whole merchant view onto the Enterprise tier, and whether the documentation allows us to place it in the outsourcing register without open questions. I will not sign before information security and procurement have both concluded.
- Owen Tallis NoneUnderstood, and that is the right order. Who signs on your side, Matthias, is it you alone on the order form?
- Matthias Ebner NoneI sign. But only once Henrik and the security team have confirmed in writing that their points are closed.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneYes, that is correct. From procurement I have a few points on the contract and the supplier register entry. Dennis has questions on the commercial side too, so perhaps we take his first, because it affects how I read the paper.
- Dennis Wolter NoneSure. My question is quite plain. Today we pay fifty thousand a year for Growth, forty users. The proposal shows a total of one hundred and twenty-five thousand. I need to understand what that number is. Is it a new annual price? Because if so, that is a very different conversation.
- Matteo Ricci NoneGood, let me be precise, because it is easy to misread. The one hundred and twenty-five thousand is the total value of the expansion deal, and it includes the one-off implementation fee. It is not an annual subscription price. Let me confirm that in writing today, with the split shown line by line.
- Dennis Wolter NoneRight. Thank you. So there is a one-off part and a recurring part inside it.
- Matteo Ricci NoneExactly, the implementation is fixed and one-off, and the subscription is annual and invoiced in advance. The order form will separate them so your finance team sees the recurring figure on its own.
- Owen Tallis NoneAnd to add to that, the current Growth subscription stays in place. We would propose to align the expansion to the existing term, so you keep one renewal date. Your contract runs to 2 Feb 2027, with renewal on 3 Feb 2027. One date, one conversation.
- Dennis Wolter NoneThat is helpful. I would rather not have two renewals at different times of the year. And the part already paid, how is that treated? Is it credited, or does the expansion simply sit on top?
- Owen Tallis NoneI do not want to improvise the invoicing mechanics on a call. What I will do is have it set out in the order form, with the invoice schedule, and you can check it against your payment calendar. Fair?
- Dennis Wolter NoneFair. Please make it explicit. I will not approve a budget line from a verbal description.
- Matthias Ebner NonePlease send it in writing, all of it. That applies to every point we discuss today.
- Matteo Ricci NoneOf course. I will send one written summary tomorrow, covering commercial terms, scope and the open security points. Nothing in it will depend on a verbal promise.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneGood. My first point, then, is exit. Our regulator expects us to show how we leave a supplier. Matthias always asks it, and he is right to.
- Matthias Ebner NoneWhat is the exit plan? In concrete terms. If we terminate, what happens to our data, and how long does it take?
- Matteo Ricci NoneYes. The architecture helps you here. The brain is built and run inside your own Snowflake account, in the EU region you chose. The data does not sit in our systems. If you leave, you keep the data where it is, and our layer on top is removed. What you lose is the working layer, not the records.
- Matthias Ebner NoneAnd the configuration, the pages and the dashboards that our teams built. Do we keep those?
- Matteo Ricci NoneThat is a fair challenge, and I do not want to overstate it. What lives in your Snowflake account stays with you. For how the dashboards and page definitions are handed over in an exit, I want to confirm the exact wording with our delivery team before I put it in your paper. I will come back to you in writing on that.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThank you. That is a better answer than a confident one.
- Owen Tallis NoneMatthias, can I add one thing on exit? We would write the handover obligation into the order form, not leave it to a side letter. If it is not in the executed document, it does not count, and I would not want you relying on it.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneThat is exactly my preference. Side letters are a problem for the register. Second point: the governance. Who on your side is the named contact for the contract, and who for incidents?
- Matteo Ricci NoneFor the contract, it is me, with Owen as the senior name for anything outside standard terms. For day to day, Elena Novak remains your customer success manager. With Enterprise there is also an executive sponsor on our side, who meets your leadership on a regular footing.
- Matthias Ebner NoneHow is this governed on the day something goes wrong? I want a person, not a mailbox.
- Owen Tallis NoneFair. On Enterprise the first response to a priority one issue is thirty minutes, and availability is ninety-nine point nine. Premium support, with a named engineer, is an add-on from the newer version of the offering, and we can price that separately if you want it. I would not bundle it in without you asking.
- Dennis Wolter NoneIs that what we have today? Because as far as I know we have had very little contact with support. One ticket last month, I think, and nothing urgent.
- Matteo Ricci NoneThat matches what I see. One ticket in the last thirty days and nothing high priority. Today you are on the Growth service levels, which have a slower first response, and the move to Enterprise tightens that.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneAnd the freshness point. Our merchant risk team works from the morning refresh. If the data is old, they act on the wrong picture. Is that covered?
- Owen Tallis NoneYes, and this is a real difference. On Enterprise, service credits cover availability and also data freshness. On Growth they cover availability only. So a brain that answers on stale data is credited on Enterprise and is not on Growth. The nightly refresh target is the same on every tier, complete by seven in the morning your local time on business days.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneGood, that is the answer I needed. I will want the credit mechanics in the paper, not only the headline.
- Matteo Ricci NoneYou will have them as written clauses, with the measurement described. What does your regulator need to see here, Henrik? If you tell me the heading in your register, I will shape the clause around it.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneMeasurable service levels, a remedy when they are missed, and an audit and information right. Those three. I can send you our standard outsourcing addendum, you may recognise most of it.
- Matteo Ricci NonePlease do. We have worked with addenda like that before with regulated buyers, and I would rather start from yours than argue about ours.
- Matthias Ebner NoneOn usage, since we are speaking of value. The merchant account managers and the risk team are using it more than last quarter. That is positive, and it is the reason we are having this conversation. But I will need to explain to our board why Enterprise and not Growth.
- Owen Tallis NoneThat is the question to answer well. From what Matteo and Elena have laid out, three reasons stand out: single sign-on and automated user provisioning, headroom on users and connectors as more teams join, and the freshness credit. If those are not things you need, then Growth is a perfectly good place to stay, and I would say so.
- Matthias Ebner NoneI appreciate that. Single sign-on is a requirement of our security team, not a preference. That is why information security is central here.
- Matteo Ricci NoneUnderstood. And here is where I would rather you heard it from me. The security review support is part of the Enterprise implementation, but I do not have a date from engineering for when single sign-on would be live in your environment. I will not give you one that has not been agreed. I will ask, and put whatever they confirm in the written summary.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThank you. An undocumented date would be worse than no date. Please make sure the answer is in writing, with a name next to it.
- Dennis Wolter NoneCan I go back to price for a moment? Is there room on the total? I am not asking for something dramatic, but I have to show that we tested it.
- Owen Tallis NoneLet me be straight with you, Dennis. What is on the proposal is already the position I can take. Let's not discount twice. And so we are clear for your planning: any introductory terms apply to the first term only, they do not carry into the renewal. I would not want you to budget for something we cannot hold.
- Dennis Wolter NoneThat is clear, and I prefer that to a vague promise. At renewal, then, we are at the list at that time.
- Owen Tallis NoneCorrect. And we will tell you the renewal position early, with the notice period, so nobody is surprised in February.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneRight. Then let me ask about termination for convenience and the notice. Our standard asks for a shorter notice than most software suppliers accept.
- Matteo Ricci NoneThat one I will take to Owen and to our legal team rather than answer now. I can say that we are used to regulated customers asking for it, and that it is a negotiable clause. Let me confirm that in writing, with the wording.
- Owen Tallis NoneAgreed. Send us your addendum, Henrik, and we will come back with a marked-up version, not a debate on a call. Who on your side will review it, you or legal?
- Henrik Lorenz NoneI read it first, then our legal colleagues. Realistically that is not complete by Wednesday. I want to be honest about that.
- Matthias Ebner NoneAnd information security has not finished either. They have their questionnaire and they have an open point on the single sign-on design. I would not like you to carry Wednesday in your forecast.
- Owen Tallis NoneThank you, that is useful, and I would much rather hear it now. We will not sit on a hopeful date. Matteo will mark the close as at risk on our side and move it once we have a dated step from you. What is the next dated step, Matthias, from your side?
- Matthias Ebner NoneInformation security should give its conclusion by the end of this week. If that is clean, procurement completes the contract review the week after. I would then sign. I cannot commit to more than that, and I will not name a day I do not control.
- Matteo Ricci NoneThat is fair, and it is honest. So, to be sure I have it right. Your security team concludes by the end of this week, procurement the week after, and then signature. I will not hold the Wednesday date and I will update our record today.
- Dennis Wolter NoneFrom finance, my approval follows the written breakdown. If I have that tomorrow, I can confirm the budget line before the security conclusion arrives. It would at least remove one dependency.
- Matteo Ricci NoneThen you will have it tomorrow, Dennis. The recurring figure, the one-off implementation, the invoice schedule and the alignment to the existing term ending 2 Feb 2027.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneOne more from me. The supplier register needs the sub-processors. Who else touches the data besides BB-Demo?
- Matteo Ricci NoneBecause the brain runs inside your Snowflake account, the data stays in your environment in the EU region. For anything beyond that, I do not want to answer from memory on a call. I will ask our security colleagues for the formal statement and attach it to the summary, so your team can read it itself.
- Matthias Ebner NonePlease do. And please make sure that statement matches what is in the contract. A difference between the two is exactly what the regulator looks for.
- Owen Tallis NoneNoted. We will have the same person check both documents. That is a good discipline and I will hold us to it.
- Dennis Wolter NoneOut of interest, how many more users could we add on the Enterprise tier before it costs extra? Our teams are growing, but slowly, and I should plan for it.
- Matteo Ricci NoneEnterprise includes a much larger user allowance than the forty you have today, so you would have a lot of room. I can put the exact allowance and the connector allowance in the summary. And if you ever pass them, extra users and connectors are available as add-ons.
- Dennis Wolter NoneGood, then growth will not surprise me. That is all from finance, thank you.
- Matthias Ebner NoneA final matter from me. If the review takes longer than expected, does anything change for the current Growth service? I do not want the merchant teams affected by our own process.
- Matteo Ricci NoneNothing changes. Growth continues exactly as it is until the expansion is signed and live. Nobody is switched over mid-review, and the existing contract stays in force.
- Owen Tallis NoneLet me say it plainly as well, Matthias. There is no deadline on our side that pushes you to rush. A rushed security review helps nobody, least of all us, because a deal signed over open questions comes back as a problem later.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThat is appreciated. I will say the same to my colleagues.
- Matteo Ricci NoneLet me recap the actions so we all leave with the same list. First, I send the written summary tomorrow with the commercial breakdown, the exit and handover wording, the service credit clauses, and the sub-processor statement. Second, Henrik sends his outsourcing addendum, and we return a marked-up version. Third, security concludes by the end of this week. Fourth, I update our forecast today so Wednesday is no longer held. Is that right?
- Henrik Lorenz NoneYes. I will send the addendum this afternoon, so you have it before your summary goes out.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThat is my understanding as well. And the single sign-on date, with a name, once engineering has agreed it.
- Matteo Ricci NoneYes, thank you for adding that. It goes in the same document, or I will tell you plainly that it is not yet agreed.
- Owen Tallis NoneAnd I will look at the marked-up addendum myself before it goes back, so there is no delay waiting for a second pair of eyes. Thanks, all. This was a clear conversation.
- Dennis Wolter NoneThank you both. I will look out for the breakdown tomorrow.
- Henrik Lorenz NoneThank you. Speak soon.
- Matthias Ebner NoneThank you, Matteo, Owen. We will speak again once security has concluded. Good afternoon.
- Matteo Ricci NoneGrazie a tutti, and goodbye for now. Best regards, all.
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