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Marcus Bell

Ashwell Mercer Interiors / BG-Demo – Check In

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Ashwell Mercer Interiors logo Ashwell Mercer Interiors · 3 Sep 2025 13:30

On 3 Sep 2025 Marcus Bell showed Craig Ashwell about four active users out of forty, down roughly a third. Craig said the price is hard to defend and agreed a project manager session and a value case.

What was said

What this says

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026

On 3 Sep 2025 Marcus Bell showed Craig Ashwell about four active users out of forty, down roughly a third. Craig said the price is hard to defend and agreed a project manager session and a value case.

What happened: Marcus showed about four people active on a typical day against forty licences. Credit control and two commercial users carry the use, the project managers barely appear, and no tickets were raised in the last month.

Customer view: Craig called it busy people reverting to spreadsheets and said he did not push it hard enough after launch. Marcus read the problem as habit, not stale data.

Commercial: Craig said the contract runs to 22 Aug 2026 and that forty-four thousand a year for four people is hard to defend to his finance director. The evidence does not show a renewal outcome.

Watch: One person asks a fair share of the questions, which is a key-person risk. Marcus advised waiting until after the session before any decision on seats.

AI · claude-sonnet-5-5 · as at Fri 9 Oct 2026

Themes

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
Theme
Usage drop, value case
Importance
renewal
Sentiment
mixed
Voice
champion

Who was there

BG-Demo

Them

Follow-up

Next steps

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • Craig Ashwell to name two or three senior project managers and find early slots the following week.
  • Craig Ashwell to send Marcus a few lines on the variation credit control caught.
  • Marcus Bell to send the by-team page and book a check-in in about a month.

Risks

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • Active use is about four of forty seats, down roughly a third on the quarter before.
  • The finance director will judge the subscription on cost per active user.
  • A large share of questions comes from one person, so use could collapse if she leaves or is away.

Opportunities

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • A session with two or three senior project managers on their own live jobs could widen use.
  • Estimating teams could use the brain if past job costs sit in a connected source.

Transcript

  1. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Hello Craig, can you hear me alright? I'm just getting the screen share sorted.
  2. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yeah, got you. Afternoon, Marcus.
  3. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Afternoon. Right, that should be sharing now. Can you see the usage page, or is it still the home screen?
  4. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Usage page. Bit small, but I can read it. Go on.
  5. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Okay, good. Thanks for making the time. What I wanted to cover is how the team's been using the brain over the last few months, and then anything that's on your mind. Does that work?
  6. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Fine. But I'll tell you now, I know why you've called. The numbers have dropped. I've seen it from my side too.
  7. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Yeah. I've pulled the numbers, and I didn't want to just send them over in an email. So you've got forty licensed users on Growth, and on a typical day we're seeing about four people active.
  8. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    About four. Out of forty.
  9. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Out of forty, yeah. And against the quarter before it's down by roughly a third. So it's not that nobody ever used it, it's that it's tailed off.
  10. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Right. Well. That's not great, is it. I stood up in front of the others and said this was how we'd see every client in one place.
  11. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I know. And that's why I'd rather look at it together than guess. Can I ask who those four people mostly are? I can see the names, but you'll know the roles better than I do.
  12. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Go on, read them out.
  13. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    So there's you, there's someone in credit control who's in most days, and then two from the commercial side. Contracts, I think, from their questions.
  14. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yeah. That's what I'd have said. The people who were always going to use it.
  15. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That's about what I see. Credit control asks the brain something most days, and you're in there most weeks. What I'm not seeing much of is the project managers.
  16. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    No. You won't. And that's the whole point of it, Marcus. That's where the variations live. Where's the variation? What has the client signed? Nobody on the project side is asking, apparently.
  17. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Mm. Do you know why? Not blaming anyone. I'm just trying to understand what's getting in the way.
  18. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Honestly? Busy. We've got a lot of jobs on at once, the project managers live on site, and they do what they've always done. Spreadsheet, a phone call, a message to the site foreman. It's quicker for them in the moment.
  19. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Right, yeah.
  20. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    And I'll be straight with you, I don't think I pushed it hard enough after the first few weeks. We had the launch, people had a look, a couple of them were keen, and then I moved on to the next fire.
  21. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That's fair, and it's not unusual. The first month there's a lot of energy and then day-to-day takes over. Can I ask, when they did try it, was there anything that put them off? Anything they said to you?
  22. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Not really complaints. That's the thing. Nobody's said it's rubbish. It's more, what's in it for me? They don't see why they'd open another screen.
  23. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Okay. That matches the tickets, actually. You've had none in the last month, no tickets at all. Which is nice in one way, but when I put it next to the usage it tells me people aren't really in there trying things.
  24. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Silence, you mean.
  25. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Quiet, yeah. Quiet rather than angry. And I'd rather have angry, to be honest, because angry I can do something with.
  26. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Ha. Fair enough.
  27. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Can I just check one thing on the data side? From what I can see, the sources are still feeding in, so the brain isn't stale. If a project manager asked it about a variation this afternoon, it would have something to say.
  28. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    So it's not a data problem.
  29. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    From where I'm sitting, no. I'd call it a habit problem. Which is the better one to have, really, because that's something we can work on.
  30. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Go on then. What do you suggest? I don't want another round of training slides. They'll switch off.
  31. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    No slides. What I'd suggest is small and practical. Happy to jump on a call with the project managers, thirty minutes, on their own live jobs. Not a demo, just their projects, their variations, and we ask it the questions they'd normally chase someone for.
  32. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    On their own jobs.
  33. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Yes. Because that's the bit that lands. If they ask it which variations are still unsigned on a job they're running and it answers in a few seconds, that's the moment they get it.
  34. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Hm. I like that. Because that is the question. Which variations are unsigned. Work's been done, nobody's recorded it, and then we're arguing about it three months later.
  35. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Exactly. And if the project managers can see those next to what's been invoiced, then your credit control people aren't chasing blind.
  36. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Right. Yes. That's what I told everyone it would do.
  37. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    It can. So who would you want in that first session? I wouldn't want forty people. A handful is better.
  38. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Let me think. Not all of them. The ones who'd actually tell the others. I've got a couple of senior project managers who run the big London jobs, and people listen to them. If they say it's useful, the rest follow. If they say it's a waste of time, we're done.
  39. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That's a good way to do it. Two or three senior people, then the others in a second wave if it goes well.
  40. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yeah. And I'd sit in. I should have sat in the first time.
  41. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That would help a lot, honestly. When the commercial director is in the room it tells them it matters.
  42. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Mm. Okay. Let me ask you something else, because I'm going to get asked. Is it just us? Is this what you see everywhere?
  43. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I'd be careful about generalising. Some customers settle into a few heavy users and that's fine for them. But you bought Growth for several teams to see the same picture, so four people isn't what you set out to have. I'm not going to pretend it is.
  44. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    No. Good. I'd rather you didn't.
  45. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    While I've got the screen up, can I show you the split by team? It's quite telling.
  46. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Show me.
  47. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    So this is the last three months, by team. Credit control is the steady line. That's the most consistent thing on here. Commercial is lower but there. And project is basically flat along the bottom.
  48. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Flat along the bottom. Wonderful.
  49. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    It was a bit higher in the first weeks after you went live, and then it fell away. That's the pattern I'd expect from what you've described, people had a look and went back to what they know.
  50. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    And what about the questions? The actual questions people ask it. Is there anything in there I should worry about?
  51. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Not worry, no. The questions are sensible. Mostly where is a client on payment, what's been agreed on a job, what did we say on the last call. A lot of it is about clients, not about the project detail. So the credit control and commercial people are getting value. It's just a narrow group.
  52. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Narrow group. That's the problem in one line.
  53. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Yeah. And one other thing, since you asked. A fair share of the questions come from one person. Which is fine, but if they're on holiday or they move on, the usage drops off a cliff. So spreading it wider helps with that as well.
  54. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yes. I know who you mean. She's brilliant, and she's the one who'd tell you that if she goes under a bus we've got nothing.
  55. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Ha, well, let's not plan for the bus. But yes.
  56. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Right. Let me be direct about something. I'm going to be asked what we're getting for this. We signed in August last year. The contract runs to 22 Aug 2026. And forty-four thousand a year for four people using it, that's a hard thing to defend.
  57. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I hear that, and I'm not going to talk you out of it. I'd say the number of people using it isn't the only way to look at it, but it's a fair thing to be asked.
  58. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    It is the way my finance director will look at it.
  59. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Understood. I'll say this, the commercial terms are Priya's side, and I don't want to get into price on a call like this. But what I can do is make sure that when the renewal conversation comes, you've got a proper picture of what the brain is worth to you. Not just a count of logins.
  60. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    A value case.
  61. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    A value case, yeah. Examples. A variation caught before the work was done, a client chased at the right moment. If you or the team can point me at one or two of those, I'll write them up.
  62. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    I've got one already. Good one. Fit-out for a landlord, extra work asked for on site, nobody wrote it down, and credit control spotted it was missing when they were looking at the client. Saved us a fight.
  63. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That's exactly what I'm after. Can you send me a couple of lines on it afterwards? No names, just what happened and what it would have cost you otherwise, if you know.
  64. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    I'll do you a few lines. I won't put the cash side in, that's for finance to say. But I'll tell you what happened.
  65. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    That's fine. The story's enough.
  66. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Okay. So what do you need from me, practically?
  67. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Three things, I think. One, the two or three senior project managers you'd want in the first session. Two, a time that works for them, ideally when they're not on site, and I can fit around that. Three, those few lines on the variation.
  68. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Times are the hard bit. They're never in the office. Early morning, before they set off, that's when I can catch them.
  69. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Early is fine for me. I'm in Manchester, so I'm up with the lark anyway. Or end of day when they're back in the van.
  70. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Ha. Early. First thing next week, I'll see what I can get.
  71. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Perfect. And for what it's worth, I'll send you the by-team breakdown after this, so you've got it in front of you if you're asked. Plain, one page.
  72. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yes please. Send it to me, not round everyone.
  73. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Just to you. Your call who sees it.
  74. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Good. Because I don't want the project managers feeling like they're being told off. That'll kill it stone dead.
  75. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Agreed. The session should feel like it's useful to them, not a register. I'll keep it about their jobs and not about how often they've logged in.
  76. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Right. What about the rest of the forty? There are people on the licence who've never touched it, I'd bet.
  77. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    There will be. I can list who's never logged in. What you might want to do is decide who really needs a seat and who doesn't. It's your call, and I'd rather you had the right people on it than a full licence nobody's using.
  78. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Hm. Honest of you.
  79. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    It's more useful to you than me being cheerful about it. Though for what it's worth I'd wait until after the project managers' session before we think about seats. See whether it catches on.
  80. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yes. Good. Let's see if it catches on first.
  81. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Can I ask about something else? The estimating people. Could they use it? Someone said to me the other week they'd like to see what we charged on the last similar job.
  82. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Possibly. It depends what's in the sources we're connected to. If the old job costs sit in a system the brain can see, then yes, it could answer that. If they're in someone's spreadsheet on a drive, then no, not without more work. I'd want to look before I said yes.
  83. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Fair. Leave that. One thing at a time. Fix the project managers first.
  84. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Agreed. Don't spread yourself thin. If the project side picks it up, other teams will start asking for it themselves.
  85. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    That's how it was meant to work. Someone sees the variation list, someone else says, can I see that. Pull, not push.
  86. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Right. And I'll be honest, I should have flagged the drop to you earlier. It's been sliding for a while and I'd rather have picked up the phone sooner.
  87. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    I should have noticed myself. I'm the champion, supposedly.
  88. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Ha. Well, we're both here now. I'd like to book a proper check-in in about a month, once the session's happened, so we can see whether anything has moved. Shall we book thirty minutes?
  89. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yes. Do that. Put it in the diary and I'll move things if I have to.
  90. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I'll send an invite today. And I'll copy Priya on the follow-up note so she knows where we are, if that's all right? Nothing about price, just that we've had this conversation and what we're doing about it.
  91. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    That's fine. Better she hears it from us than finds it on a report.
  92. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Good. Anything else on your side? Anything you wanted to raise that we haven't touched?
  93. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Let me think. No, I don't think so. It's the project managers. Everything else is secondary. Get that right and the rest takes care of itself.
  94. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I think that's right. So just to say it back. You'll pick two or three senior project managers and get me some early slots next week. I'll send you the by-team page and the invite for the check-in. And you'll send me those few lines on the variation that credit control caught.
  95. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Yes. And I sit in on the session.
  96. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    And you sit in. Brilliant.
  97. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Marcus, one thing. If this doesn't take, I want you to tell me straight. Don't dress it up.
  98. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    I will. That's the deal. You'll get the numbers as they are.
  99. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Good. Then we understand each other.
  100. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    We do. Thanks for being so open about it, Craig. It's easier to work with than people saying everything's fine.
  101. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Everything's not fine. But it's fixable. Let's get paid for what we've built, as I keep saying.
  102. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Ha. Quite. Right, I'll stop sharing. I'll get the note out to you this afternoon.
  103. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Perfect. Speak soon, Marcus.
  104. Marcus Bell
    Marcus Bell
    Speak soon. Thanks, Craig. Bye.
  105. Craig Ashwell
    Craig Ashwell
    Bye.

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