Kelvinhaugh Pension Services / BG-Demo – Proposal
Callcompleted
Kelvinhaugh Pension Services · 8 Dec 2023 11:45
Proposal call with Fiona Drummond and finance director Hamish Crawford. The £24k total is understood as one-off. Hamish wants a value case and usage numbers, and will not decide on the call. Target signature was 26 Jan 2024.
What was said
What this says
As at Fri 9 Oct 2026Proposal call with Fiona Drummond and finance director Hamish Crawford. The £24k total is understood as one-off. Hamish wants a value case and usage numbers, and will not decide on the call. Target signature was 26 Jan 2024.
What happened: Tom Ashdown walked through the Starter proposal: one team, fifteen users, four connectors, four weeks of implementation. Hamish Crawford, the finance director, joined late and asked who actually uses it after a few months.
Customer view: Hamish asked "Can we justify that to the board?" and wants usage as numbers, not a story. He said he would not decide on the call.
Commercial: The £24k total includes implementation and first year, and Tom will split the lines on the order form. Hamish prefers not to go bigger than Starter.
Watch: Fiona says the partners also need to sign off. The 26 Jan 2024 date was described as a plan, not a promise.
Themes
As at Fri 9 Oct 2026Theme
Proposal, value case
Importance
neutral
Sentiment
mixed
Voice
decision-maker
Who was there
BG-Demo
CRMmade from
Them
CRMmade from
Follow-up
Next steps
As at Fri 9 Oct 2026- Tom Ashdown to send the written proposal with the figure confirmed and an example usage report.
- Fiona Drummond to draft the list of managers who would use it.
- Tom to arrange a follow-up after Christmas, aiming at the 26 Jan 2024 signature target.
Risks
As at Fri 9 Oct 2026- Hamish Crawford needs a board-ready value case and has not decided anything.
- The partners still need to sign off, so the 26 Jan 2024 target could slip.
- Adoption depends on one team owning it and on IT involvement early.
Opportunities
As at Fri 9 Oct 2026- A usage report of questions asked, by whom and active users gives Hamish the numbers he asked for.
- A named list of fifteen managers would anchor adoption in the first team.
Transcript
Tom AshdownHello, hello. Can you hear me alright, Fiona?
Fiona DrummondLoud and clear. Morning, Tom.- Tom AshdownMorning. How's your week been? Properly busy, or just normal busy?
- Fiona DrummondBusy. Two of the scheme trustees have been on at me all week about what the relationship managers can show them before the year end, so I'm glad we're doing this today.
- Tom AshdownNo drama, that's exactly what today's for. Is Hamish joining us?
- Fiona DrummondHe's just coming off another call. Ah, hang on, I think that's him.
Hamish CrawfordApologies, both. Good morning. Back to back this morning, I'm afraid.- Tom AshdownNot at all, Hamish, we've only just got going. Fiona was telling me about the trustees.
- Hamish CrawfordYes. Before we start, if I may. Who is actually using it? When a team our size takes this on, what does adoption look like after a few months?
- Tom AshdownFair question, and I'd rather give you a straight answer than a sales one. Where it works, one team owns it and asks it real questions every day. Where it doesn't, it's bought for a whole company and nobody in particular picks it up. Starter is built for the first kind.
- Hamish CrawfordOne team.
- Tom AshdownOne team. Which is why I think it fits the scheme relationship managers rather than Kelvinhaugh as a whole. Fiona, you know them better than I do.
- Fiona DrummondRight. And that's the point I'd make, Hamish. Let's start with the partners, sorry, the managers who'll use it. They're the ones who walk into a trustee meeting and have to know the whole picture on a scheme. At the moment that's three or four systems and a lot of phone calls.
- Hamish CrawfordMm. And the phone calls are the overhead.
- Fiona DrummondThe phone calls and the preparation time, yes. I've seen this kind of thing work when the people asking the questions are the ones who feel the pain.
- Tom AshdownSo, shall I just walk through what's in the proposal? I know you've both had the document, but I'll say it in plain words and you can stop me.
- Hamish CrawfordPlease.
- Tom AshdownIt's the Starter tier. One team, up to fifteen users, and four connectors, which is the number of source systems we'd plug in. You get pages, chat and search over what's connected. Everything sits inside your own Snowflake account, so your data doesn't go anywhere else.
- Hamish CrawfordThat would need our IT involved, presumably.
- Tom AshdownA colleague in IT, yes, early on. Mostly to open up access and tell us which sources are safe to connect. It's not a big ask, but it's the thing that slips if nobody owns it.
- Fiona DrummondWho owns the client on your side, Tom? I mean who from BG-Demo would be doing that with our IT?
- Tom AshdownPriya on the commercial side while we're agreeing this, and then Daniel looks after you once you're live. He runs the check-ins. For Starter that's a six-monthly review of how it's being used.
- Hamish CrawfordSix-monthly. Not more often.
- Tom AshdownOn Starter, no. If you wanted more you'd be looking at the next tier up, and honestly I don't think you'd need it to start with.
- Hamish CrawfordGood. Let's not rush into anything bigger.
- Tom AshdownAgreed. Then there's the implementation. That's a fixed fee, four weeks, and it's where we connect the sources and check the brain is answering on your real data, not a demo set.
- Fiona DrummondFour weeks. So if we agreed in the new year we'd be live before the spring reviews.
- Tom AshdownThat's the idea, but I'd want to confirm dates in writing rather than promise them off the top of my head.
- Hamish CrawfordWhich brings me to the figure.
- Tom AshdownIt does. So the proposal comes to £23,550. That's the total with the implementation included. I'll confirm that in writing as well, I don't like quoting from memory.
- Hamish CrawfordIs that a yearly figure?
- Tom AshdownNo, careful there. It's the total for getting started, one-off implementation and first year together. I'll split it into separate lines on the order form so you can see what repeats and what doesn't.
- Hamish CrawfordThank you. That's what I'd want to be able to show the board. Can we justify that to the board? I'm not saying we can't, I'm saying I'd need to be able to explain what we get for it.
- Fiona DrummondCan I come in on that? I think the answer is time. If each manager gets even a bit of their preparation back, that's fee income per scheme we're not spending on admin. But I take the point, Hamish, we'd have to measure it.
- Hamish CrawfordMeasure it, yes. So what would the usage look like to me, as finance director, after the first quarter? Not a story. Numbers.
- Tom AshdownYou'd see how many questions are being asked, by whom, and how many people are active. That's the measure I'd pay most attention to. I'll put together what that report looks like so you're not guessing.
- Hamish CrawfordThat would help. I'm not going to decide anything on this call, Tom, you understand. I'd want to go away and think and speak to the others.
- Tom AshdownCompletely, that's how it should be. Nobody wants a signature on the back of one conversation.
- Fiona DrummondAnd the partners will want to see it too. I'm not skipping their sign-off, so it's worth giving us a bit of time.
- Tom AshdownRight. So what I'm hearing is: you want the proposal in writing with the figure confirmed, a view of what usage reporting looks like, and a bit of time. Is that fair?
- Hamish CrawfordThat's fair.
- Tom AshdownThen leave that with me. I'll send the written proposal and the usage example over, and we'll get something in the diary for after Christmas. We've pencilled 26 Jan 2024 as a target for signature, but that's a plan, not a promise.
- Fiona DrummondThat's sensible. I'll draft the list of managers who'd use it, so we can say who the fifteen are.
- Tom AshdownBrilliant. Anything else before we go? Hamish?
- Hamish CrawfordNo, thank you. That was useful.
- Tom AshdownLovely. Cheers both, have a good weekend.
- Fiona DrummondThanks, Tom. Speak soon.
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