B-Brain
Daniel Okafor

Merriott Lyle Distribution / BB-Demo – Renewal

Callcompleted

Merriott Lyle Distribution logo Merriott Lyle Distribution · 2026-01-26 12:15

CFO Malcolm Ridgway asked what the brain costs and whether unused seats are paid for. About fifty of two hundred licensed users are active. Lewis Kerr will send itemised like-for-like and deal versions; expected close 17 Feb 2026.

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What was said

What this says

Current to 13 Oct 26

CFO Malcolm Ridgway asked what the brain costs and whether unused seats are paid for. About fifty of two hundred licensed users are active. Lewis Kerr will send itemised like-for-like and deal versions; expected close 17 Feb 2026.

What happened: Renewal call on 26 Jan 2026 with the CFO, Head of Commercial Systems and Head of Credit Control. Contract ends 27 Feb 2026, with the renewal date the day after.

Customer view: Malcolm opened on cost and unused licences. Bernadette Lowry values the single dispute page but goes with the ledger when they differ, and no one could show an effect on debtor days.

Commercial: The contracted figure is £116k, matching the order form and invoices. The open renewal deal shows £128k plus VAT, which Malcolm noted is more than they pay now. Lewis said he would not add anything and floated right-sizing Enterprise users, with add-on blocks addable in term.

Watch: Malcolm wants base and add-on shown separately and will read the service schedule. Same service levels must be written into the new form. The question split may show a few heavy askers.

AI · claude-sonnet-5-5 · 13 Oct 2026

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Themes

Current to 9 Oct 26
Theme
Renewal price and seat usage
Importance
renewal
Sentiment
mixed
Voice
decision-maker
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Who was there

BB-Demo

CRMmade from

Them

CRMmade from

Follow-up

Next steps

Current to 9 Oct 26
  • Lewis Kerr to email the itemised like-for-like and deal versions, base and add-on separate, on 26 Jan 2026.
  • Daniel Okafor to send usage by branch and user, the connector check and the disputes page answer by Friday.
  • Agree expected close of 17 Feb 2026 ahead of contract end on 27 Feb 2026.
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Risks

Current to 9 Oct 26
  • About fifty of two hundred licensed Enterprise users are active, so the CFO is questioning what he pays for.
  • No measured value case exists yet: credit control cannot show an effect on debtor days.
  • The open deal total is higher than the contracted figure and Malcolm will challenge any line that does not tie.
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Opportunities

Current to 9 Oct 26
  • Set the user count at what usage supports, with add-on blocks available later, to keep the renewal on good terms.
  • Build a value case at the next account data review from real disputes and questions-asked data.
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Transcript

  1. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Hello, can everyone hear me alright? Thanks all for making the time, I know it's a busy stretch. Let me just check who has joined. I've got Malcolm, and Lewis is here from our side. Deepa, Bernadette, are you with us?
  2. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    I can hear you. What's changed since the last one?
  3. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Not a great deal, Malcolm, and I'll come to it properly. Let me just get everyone in first.
  4. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Here, sorry. The link opened in the wrong window. Good afternoon, everyone.
  5. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Afternoon. I'm on. Can you hear me?
  6. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Loud and clear. Lovely, that's everyone.
  7. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Afternoon all. So we're pointed the same way: Malcolm, what I need to understand is what you want to do at the end of February, and by when you need to know. Daniel can talk through how the year has gone, and then we can see where that leaves the commercials.
  8. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Short answer. What does it cost, what do we get for it, and are we paying for things we don't use. The contract runs out on Friday 27 February 2026, as I read it. Is that right?
  9. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    That's right. Contract end is 27 February 2026 and the renewal date on our side is the day after, 28 February 2026. So we have about a month, and I'd like it settled with room to spare.
  10. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Mm. Go on, Daniel.
  11. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Thank you. Just to close the loop on where we are: you've been with us since 28 February 2025, you're on Enterprise with two hundred licensed users, and the idea from the start was that a branch manager, a key-account manager and someone in credit control would all see the same trade account, its orders, its disputes, the calls and the invoices, in one place. On the service side it's been quiet. One ticket in the last thirty days, nothing high priority, and nothing raised about the nightly refresh. Invoices are paid, nothing overdue. So what I'd really like to hear is how the team is finding it, because the dashboards only tell me so much.
  12. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Two hundred licences. How many are used?
  13. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    That's the honest part of this, and I'd rather say it than have you find it. Over the last thirty days the average is around fifty active users, and that's down by nearly a fifth on the quarter before.
  14. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Fifty of two hundred. And the cost of that is?
  15. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Well, I wouldn't put it as a cost exactly, but I take the point, and it's one for Lewis in a moment. Before that, Deepa, I think you know better than the charts why it has dipped.
  16. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    I have a view, but I haven't got the numbers to prove it, so bear with me. When we rolled out, we wanted every branch to have a seat. A lot of those people logged in a few times, saw the account view, and then went back to ringing credit control, which is habit rather than a complaint. The people who use it properly, the key-account managers and the credit control team and a handful of the regional directors, are still on it most days. Show me where that number comes from, by branch, and I can tell you who has drifted.
  17. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    I can do that. Which account, which branch, as you'd say.
  18. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Ha, yes. Exactly that.
  19. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Can I come in? I'm one of the ones on it most days. Short version. I use it for disputes. I can see the order, the call notes and the invoice on one page. That saves me ringing three people.
  20. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    But the ledger says otherwise sometimes. And when it does, I go with the ledger. I'm not going to pretend otherwise.
  21. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    That's fair, and it's what I'd want you to do. When they differ, is it usually timing, or is it something in how the invoice comes through?
  22. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Mostly timing. A payment lands in the afternoon and the brain doesn't know until the morning. I'll believe it when it reconciles, and so far it mostly does. The one ticket this month was ours, and it was sorted.
  23. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Good. Thank you, that's helpful to hear.
  24. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Right. Put that against the money. Lewis, what is the number?
  25. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    To put a number on it. Contracted ARR is £116,500. That matches what's on the order form and what has been invoiced, so there's no gap between those. The renewal deal I have open at the moment shows a total of £127,500, plus VAT.
  26. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    That's more than we pay now.
  27. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    It is, yes.
  28. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    And what is in it?
  29. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    I'm not going to break that down from memory, Malcolm, because I'd rather check the record than guess on a call. What I'll do is send it over today, itemised, with the base for every line, so you're not reading a total without knowing what's underneath it.
  30. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Put it in writing. Every line.
  31. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Every line. And I'll say this while I have you all here. With active use where it is, I wouldn't ask you to add anything. If anything, the conversation to have is whether two hundred is the right number of users for you.
  32. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Go on.
  33. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Enterprise includes a base number of users and anything above that sits on add-on blocks. I'd need the order form in front of me to say how yours is made up and what moving the user count would do to the price. It may do a good deal, it may do very little. I don't want to quote you either way until I've read it.
  34. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Never accept a percentage without the base. Same for seats. I want the base number and the add-on number, separately.
  35. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Understood. Separately, and co-termed to your renewal so nothing runs on a different date.
  36. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Can I ask something, before we get carried away with cutting seats?
  37. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Please do.
  38. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    If you cut seats, who decides which ones? Because if it's by who logged in last, and my team have been on a training week or a month end, you'll cut the wrong people. Who decides?
  39. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    You do, Bernadette, not us. My principle would be credit control and key-account first, then regional directors, and then we look at branches. Nobody loses a seat on a number I've produced.
  40. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    And I'd want the branch list before anyone decides. Some branch managers don't open it, but their assistants do, on their behalf. That's a seat in use that doesn't look like one.
  41. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    That's a good point, Deepa. I can't see that from the usage data on its own, so it's something to ask rather than assume.
  42. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Hold on. Let me look at something.
  43. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Right. I've got the original order form open. It's got the service schedule at the back. I haven't signed anything without reading that schedule in my life and I'm not starting now.
  44. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Quite right. Anything you want me to read out, or shall I just answer questions on it?
  45. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Freshness. It says the data has to be complete before the morning on business days. And there's a credit if it isn't. How often has that been missed?
  46. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Nothing has been claimed, and I've not seen a breach in the record. Enterprise is credited for freshness as well as availability, and I'd be the first to tell you if there had been a miss. Nothing about that changes unless it's written into the new order form.
  47. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Then it stays as it is. In writing.
  48. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    In writing, yes. Same service levels, same schedule, and I'll make sure the new form says so, rather than saying nothing.
  49. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Good. Now the part I care about. A return I can show the board. Deepa.
  50. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Yes. I've been thinking about how to say this, and I'd rather be straight than clever. There are three things I can honestly point to. One, the account data review, where credit control, sales and the regional directors sit in the same meeting and look at the same account. That meeting didn't exist before this. Two, branch managers acting on what the account page says rather than what somebody told them in the car park. Three, Bernadette's team finding disputes sooner.
  51. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    And what does that do to debtor days?
  52. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    I can't tell you it moved debtor days. I can tell you disputes get found sooner. That's not the same thing, and I won't sell it as the same thing.
  53. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Good. Then say that. And how much sooner?
  54. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    I don't have a figure. Nobody has measured it. I could pull a few examples from the ledger, and I'd want the statements next to them, not a screenshot.
  55. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Let's get credit control in the room for that. I'd suggest we do it at the next account data review, with Bernadette's examples and Daniel's usage side by side.
  56. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    I'd be glad to. If it helps, the number I pay most attention to is questions asked, month on month, and who is asking them. It's the best single measure of whether a team has made it part of the working day.
  57. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    And who is asking them?
  58. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    That's exactly what I'd want to show you rather than say from memory. If a couple of people ask most of the questions, that's something we should be honest about, because it makes the whole thing fragile if one of them moves on. I'll bring you the split.
  59. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    I'd guess it's me, Bernadette and two of the key-account managers. I'd rather know than guess though.
  60. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    It's me. I'd put money on it.
  61. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Well, we'll see. Either way it's better to look at it together.
  62. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Lewis. If we renewed on what we have, exactly as it is, same users, same schedule. What would that cost?
  63. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Honestly, I'd expect it to be the contracted figure of £116,500, plus VAT, but I don't quote from memory, and I'd want to confirm there is nothing in the open deal that changes it. I'll send both: the like-for-like renewal, and the version that's on the deal record. Then you can see the difference line by line.
  64. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Both. Same day.
  65. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Same email, today.
  66. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Malcolm, can I say one thing about the regions? They're going to ask me whether anything changes for them. If seats go down, or if features are added, I don't want to tell them something that isn't true.
  67. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    You tell them nothing until I've signed.
  68. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Understood. I wasn't going to.
  69. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    While we're on the people side, can I check something? Last time we spoke there was a change among the admins at your end. Is that settled?
  70. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    It's me, and it's Bernadette's deputy for the credit control side. We're fine.
  71. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Good. Just to close the loop on that, then. I like having at least two.
  72. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Question, though. Who changed the way disputes show on the account page? It looks different from the start of the year.
  73. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    I can't tell you that from here, Bernadette, and I don't want to guess. I'll find out and come back to you by Friday.
  74. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Thank you. A dispute sitting on a page I can't explain is a dispute I can't defend.
  75. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Understood.
  76. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Sorry, one moment. Right. Back. Where were we. Timing.
  77. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Yes. The expected close on the deal is Tuesday 17 February 2026. That gives you the best part of ten days before the contract ends on Friday 27 February 2026. If you need longer for sign-off, tell me now rather than the week before, and I'll plan around it.
  78. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Seventeenth is fine if the paperwork is right. Send it this week. I'll read the schedule. If it doesn't tie to what we pay, I'll come back in writing.
  79. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    That's all I'd ask. And if what you want is the like-for-like renewal, say so and I'll make that the version I put in front of you.
  80. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    I'll say so when I've read both.
  81. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Can I ask what happens if we do reduce? Not today, but I'd want to know whether we can add them back. If the regions come back and want more seats in the summer.
  82. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Add-on blocks can be added during the term, so that's not a problem in principle. What I'd rather do is set it at a number the usage supports and add if you need it, than sell you headroom you're not using.
  83. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    That's the first sensible thing I've heard a supplier say about seats this year.
  84. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    I'll take that.
  85. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Can I add one practical thing? Whatever you decide on seats, it would help to look at the connectors at the same time. If the usage has dipped in places, I'd want to be sure it's people and not a source that has stopped loading.
  86. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Have you seen one that has?
  87. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    No, nothing that I've seen has stopped, and there's no ticket saying so. But I'd rather check and tell you, than assume and be wrong.
  88. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Check it. I'll believe it when it reconciles.
  89. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    I'll check it and I'll show you the evidence rather than just say so.
  90. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Daniel, while Malcolm's reading. Would it be possible to have the usage by branch before the next account data review? I'd rather bring the regional directors a list than a feeling.
  91. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Yes. By user and by branch, questions asked month on month, and who is asking them, with the one thing I can't see, which is people using it through someone else. I'll come back to you by Friday with what I can see.
  92. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Friday is fine. Thanks.
  93. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Right. Let me see if I've got this. One, Lewis sends me the like-for-like and the deal version, itemised, today, plus VAT stated. Two, Daniel sends usage by branch and by user. Three, the schedule stays as it is. Four, nobody tells the regions anything. Have I missed something?
  94. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    You've missed nothing. I'd add that I'll show the user numbers separately, base and add-on, as you asked.
  95. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Base and add-on. Yes.
  96. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    And someone is going to tell me who changed the disputes page.
  97. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    That's mine. By Friday.
  98. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    And I'll put the value conversation on the agenda for the next review. Bernadette, can you bring a few disputes, with statements?
  99. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    Yes. Real ones. Not the neat ones.
  100. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Real ones, please. That's the point.
  101. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    One last question for Lewis. If the number I get back is the figure on the deal. Is there any room on it?
  102. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    I'd rather not answer that on a call, in fairness to you. Let me see what is in it first. If there's something in it that isn't supported by how you use the brain, I'll say so in the email and take it out. I'm not going to defend a number I can't explain.
  103. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Fine. That's an answer.
  104. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Before we go, can I say something that isn't about money? You're one of the accounts I enjoy talking to, because you ask the awkward question. If the usage tells a worse story than you'd like, that's useful to me too. It tells me where to put the work.
  105. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    We'll keep being awkward. It's a gift.
  106. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    It's a job requirement.
  107. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Right. Anything else from anyone? No.
  108. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    Just to confirm, so there's no doubt on the timing. The email goes today. You've the week to read it. Expected close is Tuesday 17 February 2026 and the contract ends Friday 27 February 2026, with the renewal date the day after.
  109. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Understood. I'll come back if it doesn't tie.
  110. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Could one of you send the invite for the review, Daniel, with the usage attached once you have it?
  111. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    I will. Usage first, by Friday, and I'll suggest a date for the review in the same note so you can see what fits.
  112. Bernadette Lowry
    Bernadette Lowry None
    I need to drop, I have an account on stop waiting for me. Regards, all.
  113. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Thank you, Bernadette. Speak soon.
  114. Deepa Chauhan
    Deepa Chauhan None
    Thanks, both of you. I'll go and see whether the regional directors have noticed they're meant to be somewhere. Thanks, Deepa, out.
  115. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Anything outstanding on your side, Daniel?
  116. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Only what I've said. Usage by branch and by user, the check on the connectors, and the answer on the disputes page, all by Friday. And thank you for your time, Malcolm, I know this wasn't a comfortable number to open with.
  117. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    It was the right one to open with.
  118. Lewis Kerr
    Lewis Kerr None
    I'll send that over today, then. Thanks, Malcolm, and thanks Daniel.
  119. Malcolm Ridgway
    Malcolm Ridgway None
    Good. Goodbye.
  120. Daniel Okafor
    Daniel Okafor None
    Lovely. Best wishes, all. Speak soon.
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