B-Glass
Tom Ashdown

Penmaen Software / BG-Demo – Discovery

Callcompleted

Penmaen Software logo Penmaen Software · 9 May 2024 12:45

Cerys Llewellyn wants one operator-level view of tickets, renewals and usage. CFO Huw Bevan asked about adoption, overhead and cost, and committed to nothing. Tom Ashdown gave Growth at £52k all-in as a verbal estimate.

What was said

What this says

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026

Cerys Llewellyn wants one operator-level view of tickets, renewals and usage. CFO Huw Bevan asked about adoption, overhead and cost, and committed to nothing. Tom Ashdown gave Growth at £52k all-in as a verbal estimate.

What happened: On 9 May 2024 Tom Ashdown ran a discovery call with Cerys Llewellyn and Huw Bevan. No demo was given and no decision was taken.

Customer view: Cerys said the team cannot say early enough which leisure operators will renew. Today it is three tabs and a spreadsheet that is out of date the day after. Huw asked who actually uses such a tool and what the overhead would be.

Commercial: Tom pointed to Growth with eight weeks of implementation and forty users. He quoted £52k all-in, implementation included, as the total and not a yearly figure, to be confirmed in writing.

Watch: Tom's 11 Jul 2024 decision date was his guess. The evidence does not show whether a proposal, demo or order followed.

AI · claude-sonnet-5-5 · as at Fri 9 Oct 2026

Themes

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
Theme
Operator-level renewal visibility
Importance
upsell
Sentiment
neutral
Voice
decision-maker

Who was there

BG-Demo

Them

Follow-up

Next steps

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • Cerys Llewellyn sends the list of day-to-day users and first operators early the following week.
  • Tom Ashdown sends a note on the set-up, the Snowflake point and the cost breakdown.
  • Tom Ashdown books a demo on Penmaen's own data.

Risks

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • Huw Bevan doubts adoption and worries about the overhead on Penmaen's side.
  • The £51,600 figure is a verbal estimate and no proposal has yet separated the one-off from the subscription.
  • Cerys Llewellyn wants to prove value on the team's own data before asking internally.

Opportunities

As at Fri 9 Oct 2026
  • Growth fits several teams, with forty users and a dashboards builder for a renewals view.
  • Joining tickets, CRM and usage at operator level answers the problem Cerys described.
  • Running inside Penmaen's own Snowflake account addresses the finance and security concern.

Transcript

  1. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Hello, hello. Can you both hear me all right? Cerys, Huw, afternoon.
  2. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Afternoon, Tom. Yes, loud and clear. Huw's just joining, I can see him on the other tab.
  3. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Afternoon. Apologies, I was finishing something. Can you hear me?
  4. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Perfect, no drama. How's your week been? Anything exciting down in Cardiff, or is it all spreadsheets?
  5. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Spreadsheets, mostly. Month-end is close.
  6. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    And mine's been a lot of questions from the team. They asked me this week how many of our leisure operators are actually likely to renew, and honestly I couldn't answer without a day's digging. That's really why I asked for this call.
  7. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    That's a good place to start, actually. So let me say how I'd like to use the time, and tell me if it's wrong. I'd like to understand how your customer success team works today, which systems you pull from, and what a good answer would look like. I'm not here to demo anything yet. Is that all right?
  8. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    That's all right. Let's start with the team who'll use it. There are a handful of us. Each of us looks after a group of operators, the gyms and leisure centres, and we're trying to keep an eye on who's healthy and who's at the edge.
  9. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    And when you say at the edge, what are you looking at now to tell?
  10. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Tickets, mostly. How many, how quickly we answered, whether it's the same issue coming back. Then the renewal date in the CRM. Then usage of our own product, per operator, which sits somewhere else again. I've seen this work when it's all in one view. At the moment it's three tabs and my memory.
  11. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Right, yeah. Three tabs and memory, I think that's most people, to be fair. Who builds the picture today? Is it you?
  12. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Often me, or one of the team in a spreadsheet before a quarterly review. It's out of date the day after.
  13. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    May I ask something? Who is actually using the thing, in a company like yours or ours, once it's in? I've seen tools bought and then not opened.
  14. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Fair question, and I'd rather you asked it now. The honest answer is it depends on whether it's built around a job people do every week. If the team opens it before every operator call or review, it sticks. If it's a dashboard somebody looks at once a month, it doesn't. That's why Cerys's starting with the team who'll use it matters.
  15. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Mm. And what would we lose if we did nothing?
  16. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Time, mainly, Huw. And visibility on renewals. I don't want to say we'd lose customers, because I don't know that. But I couldn't tell you early enough.
  17. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Understood. Let's not rush.
  18. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    No, no rush at all. So, can I ask about the systems? Without naming anything fancy, where do your tickets live, where do your renewals live, and where does the product usage come from?
  19. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Tickets are in our helpdesk. Renewals and contacts are in the CRM. Usage comes out of our own platform's reporting, and that's the awkward one, because it's by account, and we think in terms of operator, which can have several accounts.
  20. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Okay. So an operator is the unit you care about, and the systems all think in different units.
  21. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Exactly that. A leisure operator might have six sites, each with its own account on our side, and one contract. So to see how Operator X is doing, someone has to add things up.
  22. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Right. And that's a thing we're good at, joining it up so the question is asked at the operator level. I'll want to see an example of that from your side before we go further, so we do the demo on your own data and not a made-up one.
  23. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Would that mean people from our side doing work? I have to think about the overhead.
  24. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Some, yeah, I won't pretend otherwise. Somebody technical needs to give us read access to the sources. After that it's mostly us. We build and run it inside your own Snowflake account, so the data stays with you, which tends to settle the nerves of finance and security folk.
  25. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    It stays in our environment?
  26. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    It does. Yours, not ours. We work inside it.
  27. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Good. I'd want that written down at some point.
  28. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Leave that with me. I'll put it in the follow-up.
  29. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Can I ask how long before we see something useful? Because my team will lose patience if it's months.
  30. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Fair. For the tier I think suits you, Growth, the implementation is about eight weeks, and you'd see the first useful views before that, as the sources come online. I'll confirm the detail in writing rather than quote it off the top of my head.
  31. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    That's fine. And Growth, that's several teams, yes?
  32. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Several teams, yeah. Forty users, so you'd have headroom if finance or the account managers want a look as well. And there's the dashboards builder, so you can make the renewals view yourselves.
  33. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    I'd like to understand the scale of the cost. Roughly. I won't hold you to it.
  34. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    No, course. Again, I'll confirm it in writing, but the way it's sitting on my side is Growth at £51,600 all-in, implementation included. So that's the total for the deal, not a yearly figure. I'll break it out properly in the proposal so you can see what's the one-off and what's the subscription.
  35. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Understood. Thank you. And you'd want a decision by when?
  36. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    The date I've pencilled is Thursday 11 July 2024, but that's my guess, not a deadline. If you need longer, you need longer.
  37. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Good. I won't decide anything today, you'll understand. I'd want to see what the team would use first.
  38. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    That's fair, Huw. And I'd want the same, honestly. I've seen this work, but I'd want to prove it here before I ask for it.
  39. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    That's exactly how I'd want you to do it. So, next steps, to see if we're agreed. One, Cerys, you tell me who in the team would use it day to day, and which operators you'd want to look at first. Two, I send you a short note on the set-up, the Snowflake point Huw raised, and the cost breakdown. Three, we get something in the diary for a demo on your own data. Does that work?
  40. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Works for me. I'll have the list of names and operators to you early next week.
  41. Huw Bevan
    Huw Bevan
    Fine. Thank you both.
  42. Tom Ashdown
    Tom Ashdown
    Brilliant. Cheers, both, I'll get that note over. Enjoy the rest of your afternoon.
  43. Cerys Llewellyn
    Cerys Llewellyn
    Diolch, Tom. Speak soon.

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